Join the Trinity?

Jesus never claimed to be the same person as His Father. Not once. He only claimed to be ONE with his Father, so much so, he could say, "When you see me, you see the Father." It seems that the only way the Council of 300+ bishops at Nicaea could explain the seemingly dual nature of Jesus was to assert that Jesus and His Father were exactly the same person. But since Jesus never makes that claim, we should be hesitant to blindly accept the claims of these men who were making decisions over 300 years after the events. This may sound like heresy, but my challenge is to the bishops, not to Jesus himself. If Jesus claimed unity with his Father, that's what he had. He didn't claim to be of one substance with his Father, which is what the Nicaean and Athanasian Creeds so boldly declare. This was their best solution. But we don't need to jury-rig this one. The answers are presented in John chapters fourteen through sixteen, the passage where Jesus gives final instructions to his disciples. It is in this passage that Jesus explains his unity with his Father, then invites them to share in the same kind of unity with him after his ascension. Wait a second. Join the Trinity? We can't even understand it, much less join it. "I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one." John 17:20-22 How can we possibly be one "as they are one," if we could never understand their unity? The mystery, as Jesus presents it in John 14, is answered in a riddle: Philip said to Him, "Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us." Jesus said to him, "Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how can you say, 'Show us the Father'? Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works." Clearly the Bishops at Nicaea were not science fiction fans. They would have loved that solution. What about you? Can you explain the riddle (in bold above)? If you know the answer, be thou silent...

8 comments:

Mrs. Frank said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mrs. Frank said...

If we all get to join the Trinity, does that make us the Infinity?

Gardiner Rynne said...

Who's going to comment with your last statement?

John Barnts said...

You. And Laurie. And me.

Good point, knowing the answer would be the very reason they WOULD post. Don't bring logic into this Gardiner. This is a CHRISTIAN post!

I was really just talking about people in my Bible Study that would ruin my next post...

Jenn said...

Yeah, you kill joy.

Jenn said...

hmm, er, I mean killjoy, the person....but come to think of it that's kind of harsh anyway. sorry!

John Barnts said...

Actually, I think kill joy is appropriate.

AnonyMom said...

I don't understand what all the fuss is. I can't even find the word [TRINITY] in MY Bible.
I wanted to comment on the question of would Jesus smoke a cigarette? I would vote but there isn't an option for "Other" to pick to vote for. I would choose "Other" because Jesus only did what His Father told Him to do and I can't imagine God telling Him to light up.